Cheryl “Salt” James stands as a foundational architect of Hip Hop’s golden age, transcending her beginnings as a nursing student in Queens to become a global cultural icon.
As one-half of the trailblazing duo Salt-N-Pepa, she was instrumental in dismantling the gender barriers of a burgeoning genre. With a sophisticated delivery and an innate sense of rhythm, Salt didn’t just participate in the rap scene; she redefined it. By blending street-level authenticity with a polished, pop-accessible sensibility, she helped transform Hip Hop from a subculture into a dominant force on the global charts, proving that female-led narratives possessed immense commercial and artistic viability.
Throughout her career, Salt became a symbol of female empowerment and sexual frankness, steering the group through massive crossover successes like “Push It” and “Shoop.”
Today, Salt is recognized not just as a rapper, but as a cultural pioneer who paved the way for every generation of female emcees that followed.
The Hip Hop Museum caught up with Salt to discuss crossover success, the challenges of being in a group, Hip Hop today, and more.
Before checking out the interview, watch Salt’s video for “King & Queens” shot on-site at The Hip Hop Museum:
Adam Aziz: To start, I wanted to ask about ‘Hot, Cool & Vicious.’ When that was blowing up, Hip Hop was very much still in its infancy. What unique challenges did you face as a group coming up in that era?
Salt: I wouldn’t really know about the challenges because we didn’t have any. As soon as we hit the ground running, we haven’t stopped yet. I feel like it was actually less challenging because it was less crowded. If you had the stamina, the music, and the public’s attention, there wasn’t really that much competition around. You couldn’t get “lost in the sauce.”
I always say that Salt-N-Pepa brought fun, fashion, and femininity to Hip Hop. That really resonated with the “round-the-way” girls and guys. I think we were just very authentic and relatable; we looked like we were having a good time and representing who we actually were.
If I thought there were any challenges, I would say the challenge to be taken seriously within the Hip Hop community because we were girls and our sound was very different. It was unheard of. It was super specific to us and our camp, the Idol Makers camp, because there was Kwamé, Kid ‘n Play, Salt-N-Pepa, Dana Dane, Hurby “Luv Bug” Azor, Antoinette, and Sweet Tee. We had our own clique, and we carved out a niche for ourselves. I feel like we just had blinders on; this is what we were going to do, and we were going to do it.
AA: I’m always fascinated when artists record songs that end up being huge hits. As an example, when you recorded “Push It”, did you think it was a B-side or did you know it was a smash?
Salt: Me and Pepa didn’t even like “Push It.” It was so different from what we were doing because we were a little more gritty. Then you had “I’ll Take Your Man” and “My Mic Sounds Nice” with the jazz vibe. “Push It” was so to the left for us, but Hurby being the genius that he is, we trusted to just follow his lead.
When we made “Push It,” “Tramp” was the actual single, and the record company was like, “What’s up with the B-side?” So it was kind of like a run in there and throw this little song together just to satisfy that requirement. The crazy thing about “Push It” is we made it, forgot about it, and then we were on the road performing. A DJ—I want to say he was in San Francisco; I hate that I don’t remember this man’s name—he just turned the record over and started playing it. Without payola or anything, that thing just took off. It was such a good song that people just started putting it into rotation. We were on the road and somebody called and said, “Do ‘Push It’.” We were like, “Do ‘Push It’?” They’re like, “Yeah, they’re playing it.” So we did “Push It” one night not knowing, and the crowd went crazy. We were shocked. We had no idea. And “Push It” to this day is the closer.
AA: That goes into my next question. So few people get to experience the Pop superstardom you experienced with ‘Very Necessary.’ What was that transition to massive super stardom like, especially for the group who were true MCs of the culture.
Salt: It was definitely different when we did ‘Very Necessary.’ We went from kind of dressing ourselves, Hurby’s brother made up the dance steps, very grassroots, just kids doing our thing. Then we had Matthew Rolston, we had En Vogue on a song, and we had a stylist. We actually had hair and makeup for real. All these things were different at that point. It felt like a level up; it was time to really embrace the mega-ness and hugeness of Salt-N-Pepa. We were worldwide now and weren’t doing the grassroots stuff anymore. We were pop stars, pretty much. People started calling us sellouts because we went from this gritty Hip Hop to this international success. It was when pop was not popular. We went pop when it wasn’t popular. We started having worldwide attention and success, so it just felt like par for the course. I always felt like Salt-N-Pepa was going to be huge. I don’t know why—intuition, God, I have no idea—but in my spirit, I was like, “Oh, this is going to be big.”
AA: As an artist, you and the group never lost their attachment to Hip Hop culture, even as your careers grew. How did you retain that attachment to the culture which people aren’t always able to do?
Salt: As an artist, you have to always cater to your core audience. There are songs we did in the beginning that solidified us with our core audience. I think it’s a mistake when people forget about the people who were really there in the beginning—when we were riding around in Pep’s beat-up Datsun to shows and coming in the back door to the skating rink because we were embarrassed for them to see what we were driving. You have to remember where you came from and always respect the people that put you on.
We never forgot who really put us here and who made us Salt-N-Pepa: the fans. It was the fans in our neighborhood in Queens and all the “hoods” of the world, even in Brixton, London. Knowing where your core audience is and how important they are is key. Personally, we also just never bought into the hype. Flavor Flav’s best words ever said: “Don’t Believe the Hype,” because that’s when you lose your mind.
AA: Why didn’t Salt-N-Pepa make an album after 1997?
Salt: There was a lot of internal stuff going on. There is a lot to that question. Hurby was my boyfriend, and then we broke up. There were some internal issues. Hurby sued us. You come into this business with rose-colored glasses, and then reality hits you. You get sued, and it becomes about money and unresolved issues. Then I think everybody starts feeling like “been there, done that.” It’s hard to bring everybody together again on one accord. Everybody has to want to come together and make magic, and people are in different phases of their lives—married, divorced, kids, all the things.
When you’re young, it’s like, “Yay, let’s come together and be stars. We’ll do whatever we’ve got to do.” I used to tie dancers’ shoes on set—there was nothing I wouldn’t do to make it happen. After a while, you probably become a little more jaded. Artistic differences, unresolved issues. I could go on and on. It’s hard being in a group.
Every group has problems, especially as you get older and start figuring out who you are as an individual. When you’re a kid, you start a group like a gang. It’s all about us. When you get older, it’s really challenging to be in a group.
AA: I read an older interview where you said “Hip Hop is a state of mind.” What did you mean by that?
Salt: A lot of artists who try to come into Hip Hop culture weren’t even connected to how it started or where it’s from. I remember the first time I heard the music. I lived in Brooklyn, and across the street from me was Bushwick High School. On the side of the school was a park, and back then, that’s where the music was; in the parks and block parties. I was young and wasn’t allowed to go to the park, but I used to sneak there and see the B-boys and the DJs. It was so addictive. You just start absorbing the culture. You have an understanding of it because you’re there from the beginning, and it started where you’re from. I think what I meant by a “state of mind” is the connectivity of what it really is and how it started. A kid from the suburbs—not that that’s a bad thing—they might be great writers and rappers, but do they understand the culture?
That’s why I love The Hip Hop Museum; preserving that and making sure we don’t forget how this phenomenon happened. Hip Hop is the only music that I can think of that has bled into every aspect of culture: choreography and dance, fashion, music. It’s a way of being. It’s in your bones.
AA: Building off of that. How do you feel about Hip Hop today?
Salt: Honestly, I feel like it’s gotten a little bit off track from its original purpose, which was to not only entertain, but encourage, inspire, inform, and celebrate who we are and where we come from. Not that it was always positive, but it always had meaning and soul to me. In the beginning, it was something I felt was contributing to and not taking away from.
I feel like there’s an imbalance, and the pendulum has to swing back because Hip Hop is so influential on young people. From a woman’s point of view, if we’re all talking about the same thing, it loses the element of diversity. Missy Elliott was the innovator; Latifah was the Queen; Salt-N-Pepa brought the fun, fashion, and femininity; Lauryn Hill was the consciousness; and Lil’ Kim had that sexual empowerment thing on lock. Now it feels like it’s all going in one direction, and it worries me for the young women who need guidance and might end up feeling like what they have to offer between their legs is their identity. I’m all for sexual female empowerment, but I feel like some things can go too far, where it’s just not healthy.
AA: Why do you think Hip Hop having its own physical space with The Hip Hop Museum is important?
Salt: It’s important because it belongs to us. I can see the Hip Hop Hall of Fame and award shows being done in that museum. It belongs to us; it’s not us outsourcing to these other venues. It’s us celebrating us. It is also important because history is being rewritten over and over, and with AI and everything, we are starting not to know what’s what. Having a brick-and-mortar place where you can go and see how this actually started—the actual truth—is important.
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